16 June 2009

East Surrey Regiment - 1st & 2nd Battalions


This post will look at army service numbers and the dates on which they were issued to men joining the regular battalions (1st and 2nd Battalions) of the East Surrey Regiment.

There are over 37,000 East Surrey Regiment service and pension records (for this regiment - and its antecedents) in various War Office series held at the National Archives. Clicking on the link will take you to the results on Findmypast but you will need a subscription or Pay-Per-View credits to actually view the records. Some of these records can also be viewed on-line on Ancestry although Findmypast has by far the most comprehensive service record collection.


Use the regimental numbers and dates on which these were issued, below, to determine parameters for when your own East Surrey Regiment ancestor would have joined up. Note though that these numbers are only for regular enlistments. Special Reserve and Territorial Force battalions operated completely separate regimental number sequences.

The regiment was born in July 1881. The 1st Battalion, East Surreys had previously been the 31st (The Huntingdonshire) Regiment of Foot. The 2nd Battalion, East Surreys had previously been the 70th (Surrey) Regiment of Foot.

My data for this regiment begins the year after it was formed, in 1882. What follows is a snapshot of numbers and dates from a far larger database. From October 1902 numbers were generally, but not always, prefixed with the letter L/. I have omitted this prefix from the series below.

83 joined on 7th January 1882
773 joined on 16th February 1883
1302 joined on 13th May 1885
1827 joined on 11th October 1886
2052 joined on 9th September 1887
2332 joined on 26th March 1888
2538 joined on 1st January 1889
2966 joined on 10th April 1890
3341 joined on 21st January 1891
3970 joined on 29th December 1892
4396 joined on 10th August 1893
4784 joined on 6th June 1894
4929 joined 17th May 1895
5059 joined on 20th July 1896
5451 joined on 29th October 1897
5605 joined on 29th October 1898
5806 joined on 13th January 1899
6271 joined on 30th January 1900
6902 joined on 26th January 1901
7181 joined on 4th January 1902
7664 joined on 12th January 1903
8104 joined on 12th Januar 1904
8632 joined on 9th October 1905
8806 joined on 7th July 1906
9347 joined on 20th November 1907
9545 joined on 13th February 1908
9774 joined on 6th January 1909
9910 joined on 4th January 1910
10134 joined on 5th January 1911
10355 joined on 4th January 1912
10600 joined on 1st January 1913
10787 joined on 7th January 1914
10918 joined on 3rd August 1914

The following day, Britain went to war with Germany. As with regular enlistments into the King's Royal Rifle Corps, The Royal Sussex Regiment and The Buffs (East Kent Regiment) during the First World War, The East Surrey Regiment maintained the number series above for men who, during wartime, still wished to enlist in the regiment as career soldiers for 7&5 (Seven years with the colours, five on the Reserve). Men joining up for wartime service only were given numbers from a separate series prefixed with the letter G/. So to continue with the regular numbering:

11012 joined on 23rd November 1914
11039 joined on 29th December 1914
11079 joined on 15th January 1915
11124 joined on 1st February 1915
11176 joined on 13th March 1915
11235 joined on 23rd April 1915
11251 joined on 18th May 1915
11269 joined on 3rd June 1915
11325 joined on 9th September 1915
11369 joined on 3rd December 1915

My data for regular East Surrey enlistments currently ends at this point but I'd be happy to augment the series above if anybody can add to this.

It is important to make the distinction between numbers issued from the regular L/ prefix series and numbers issued from the wartime G/ prefix series. For instance whereas G/11554 was issued on 11th August 1915 to a man joining up for wartime service only, the same number (but with an L/ prefix) would, as can be deduced from the series above, have been issued to a man joining up for regular service between October and December the same year.

The photograph that I've use to illustrate this post with, comes from my Chailey 1914-1918 archive and shows L/6738 Private Charles Sabourin of the 1st East Surrey Regiment recuperating at Hickwells, Chailey. Charles is seated in a wheelchair having lost his right leg as a result of a wound sustained on the first day of fighting at Mons - 23rd August 1914. A Boer War veteran who had enlisted on 31st October 1900, the bitterness he felt as a result of his wound, subsequent spell as a POW, and then repatriation, is evident in the entry he left in his nurse's autograph album. He wrote:

Pte C Sabourin
1st East Surrey Regt
Wounded and captured at Mons

I would like to meet the German
who fired that shrapnel. I would
certainly treat him.


Charles Sabourin is one of those rare cases who has papers in both WO 363 and WO 364. These documents are also now available on-line.


I also offer a comprehensive, fast and cost-effective military history research service. Follow the link for more information.

130 comments:

John said...

Hi
I am researching my grandfather Sgt.THOMAS PADIN, who served in the East Surrey regt. on 3 occasions. We know he joined about 1888 his number was 2087. He served in India with 1st bat. He was an acting drummer in E company. He left Agra in 1895. In 1899 he served in 2nd bat. in South Africa.
During WWI he served with 9th bat. and was wounded at the battle of Loos in 1915. He was discharged on May 25th 1917 (sickness), he was then in a training reserve battlion. On his pension records his original number is given as 905, this does not make sense?
Would you know if it is possible that his records for his first or second stint in the army still exsists, and if they do, where would i look for them?
Regards
John Wiggins

Paul Nixon said...

John

Thanks for your comment.

The number SR/GSES/905 comes from a new series of numbers which was issued to men who joined the Special Reserve for war time service. The SR stands for Special Reserve, the GS for General Service and the ES for East Surrey. This series began at 1 in August 1914 and your grandfather joined on September 21st that year, the 905th man to be issued with a service number from that series. He was later posted to a service battalion but retained his 905 number.

As you'll have seen - and as I have now seen too - his service record states that he had 16 years' prior service in the East Surreys. His number, 2087, dates to between September and November 1887 and at a guess, October.

As for other surviving records, if he was discharged to pension before 1913 (which seems likely)there might be records for him in WO 097. Follow this link for more information:

http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/gettingstarted/looking-for-person/britisharmysoldierupto1913.htm

Paul Nixon

Anonymous said...

Hello,
Is it known roughly what the WW1 East Surrey Regt record numbers were that were lost/burnt in WW2? The number that is almost probably my granddads was no.11572. Thanks for any advice. Lin.

Paul Nixon said...

Lin

The destruction of WW1 records often appears to be random and I haven't analysed - or noticed even - significant gaps in say, surnames. Some regiments certainly fared better than others however.

11572 was issued to Joseph Pennington. His medal index card does not make it clear whether he was a G/ prefix or an L/ prefix but if he was the former he joined the East Surreys around the 11th August 1915, and if the latter, between October and December 1915. There does not appear to be a survivng service record for him.

Paul Nixon

Anonymous said...

Hello Paul,
Thanks for the quick reply and information, it's much appreciated. All we know is that he was gassed on the Somme and also received a shrapnel wound to his head [don't know if this was at the same time, sadly it looks as though we won't find out anymore. Thanks again. Lin.

Paul Nixon said...

Lin

If you've not already done so, you should check the medal roll. The reference on his medal index card will give you the appropriate roll and page number and that in turn may give you his battalion. Armed with the battalion information you can then access the battlion war diary which will enable you to plot exactly where your grandfather served (although the diary probably won't mention him by name). The diary and the medal rolls are at the National Archives in Kew.

Anonymous said...

hi
i am trying to find out about my great grandfather Thomas Henry Wilson born ist july 1883.
family stories say that Thomas Henry Took the kings shilling and inlisted in the east surry regiment when 17, possibly joining with 7 years serving witht he colours and 5 years reserve. it is thought that he served in south africa in the boer war and subsequently visited the north west frontier of india. how would i go about the confirmation of these suppostitions?
jaime

Paul Nixon said...

Jaime

Medal rolls for the East Surrey Regt for the Boer War should confirm whether or not he served during that conflict. You'd also need to check WO364, WO363 and WO97 series at the National Archives, or hire a researcher to do that for you.

Anonymous said...

Hello,

can you help me please my ggrandfather robert stewart L/7511was in the east surrey regiment,As i have not been able to find either war records or pension records i am searching for other avenues of search, on his medal index card he was issued the silver war badge, family say he was shot in the foot, can the silver war badge roll be veiwed as i may get some more information from it? he was discharged in 1917 was there a converlesant home the regiment used? is there any other areas of search you can suggest?

Alan.

Paul Nixon said...

Alan

L/7511 Pte Robert Stewart joined the East Surrey Regt in late Sep or early Oct 1902 which means he would have been a Reservist when war was declared. The SWB roll is unlikely to yield agreat deal of information but you will get his battalion and possibly his date of birth so it's worth checking. Also have aread through the war diary once you know his battalion. You'll find both at the National Archives.

As to convalescent homes, he could have gone to one of many thousand. He may have gone to a military hospital in the first place and then possibly to an auxiliary hospital run by VADs.

Anonymous said...

I am looking for info on my gr uncle Henry Thomson who was a career soldier in the East Surrey Regiment. His number was L3334. I cannot find his service record and I have Ancestry. He was still in the army CO1 and an instructor in 1920 as far as I know. He lived 44 Crown St Egham in 1911. Please let me know where I can find out more about him. I am looking for my family.

Thank you

Dianne Paddock
Canada

Paul Nixon said...

Diana

Henry Paddock's medal index card indicates that he did not go overseas until January 1916 at the earliest. If you have Ancestry, you should be able to access that. If you don't know the battalion/s he served with, your best bet would be to access the BWM and Vic medal roll at the National Archives which may tell you the battalion. Then, armed with that knowledge you can access the war diary. As he was a warrant officer, you may be lucky and find that he gets a mention. It's a long shot but you should investigate that avenue.

mike said...

Hi searching my Uncle Frederick Charles Johnson, service number 8252, with the east Surrey reg. !st Batt.according to Ancestry he was killed at France Flanders 27th April 1915.He married in 1913 and was a postman in the Paddington area. I cannot find any more about his military service, ie when he joined etc... can u help rgds Mike Sadler

Paul Nixon said...

Mike

L/8253 Frederick Charles Johnson; born Westminster, enlisted London; arrived France and Flanders on the 11th September 1914.

The L/ prefix tells us he was a regular soldier and the number dates to between 27th May and 7th June 1904.

Paul

Anonymous said...

Hi Paul
Great blog!!

My work colleague produced some war medals a week back belonging to his Great Grandfather. He was so proud of them but knew absolutely nothing about his ancestor John Egan. I offered to do all I could to bring the story back to him and his family.

Lance Corporal John Egan L/10067 joined up in 1910 and later was wounded and taken prisoner on 23rd Aug 1914 at Mons Canal.

Unfortunately no service/pension papers seem to have survived and therefore I seem to have hit a brick wall in my search. Is there any way of finding out what happened to him thereafter, where he was kept as a POW or hospital records after he was released etc.

Thank you in advance

Steve

Paul Nixon said...

Hello Steve

10067 dates to September or October 1910. The E Surreys lost a lot of men on the 23rd August 1914 and I have written about one of these men on my Chailey 1914-1918 website. Check http://www.chailey1914-1918.net/charles_sabourin.html

Charles was returned by the Germans in 1915. He had lost his leg as a result of the 23rd August action and so he was no use to the Germans or - they assumed - to his country. A lot of men with similarly severe injuries were returned at the same time. I presume that those men who were still fit, however, were retained as POWs for the duration of the war. The National Archives has an archive of interviews with WW1 POWs and the Red Cross in Switzerland may also hold a file on this man.

Paul

Anonymous said...

Hello Paul
Thank you very much for your prompt reply and thank you for your suggestions. Just one last question; reading through the early entries of the diary for the 5th battalion it points out where each company was and what they were involved in, is there any way I can find out what company Lance Corporal John Egan L/10067 was in?

All the best
Steve

Anonymous said...

Hi This website was great bit I am trying to find out about Private ROBERT HERBERT THOMPSON. He was Surrey born and was wounded in Poziere resulting in his leg being aputated.
Thanks

Paul Nixon said...

Re Robert Herbert Thompson, do you know anything else about him? His regiment for instance? When he was wounded? Unfortunatley the name is quite common and narrowing him down from a name and rank on its own could be quite difficult.

Anne Stone said...

Hello. Trying to research my maternal grandfather, Cecil Alexander Wilson of the East Surrey Regiment, 2nd Lieut., then RASC (what is that?) Lieut. His card says page 366D medals Victory, british and Star (15? Off/106 page 26 then IV.X/3079 ?? 30.1.24 EF/8/8753
App for 15 Star medals & M in D (mentioned in Dispatches?) 11.11.23 EF 9 or a retd off. 23.11.23 I think he was still serving when they lived in Sligo but returned to England and died when my mother was just 2 yrs old.

Paul Nixon said...

Anne

The references are to the volumes and pages of the medal rolls which are held at The National Archives in Kew. RASC is Royal Army Service Corps. As an officer he wouldn't have had a number but he probably has a surviving service record which, because it appears he was still serving in 1923, may still be with the Ministry of Defence.

Anonymous said...

Hi My grandfatherr, Henry Edward Grant was in the East Surrey 2nd BATTALION, REGT NO. S/7110.I have found his medal index card but his medals are long gone, is it possible to get copies?

Paul Nixon said...

It is not possible to buy official replacements; that was stopped some while ago. However you could buy replicas from one of the many companies out there offering such a service.

Incidentally your relative's number indicates that he originally joined either the 3rd (Special Reserve) or 4th (Extra Reserve) Battalions of the East Surrey Regt in December 1911 or early 1914 respectively.

Kirsty said...

Oh thats strange, I have downloaded his medal index card and it says 2d E.Surr s/7110 then The Queens L/7110, then e.Surr again L/12568. Date of entry was 5.10.15

Paul Nixon said...

That's correct, Kirsty, but the S/ prefix indicates that he originally served with the 3rd or 4th battalion and was subsequently posted to the 2nd Battalion.

Remember, that the medal index card only gives you the battalion he arrived with when he stepped off the boat into a theatre of war. He could have served with ten different battalions and had different numbers before that date, but the MIC won't record those.

The subsequent Queen's and East Surrey numbers are those issued to regular soldiers; the L/ prefix tells us that.

Kirsty said...

Oh right, thanks for the info, we have very little information about him, only that he also recieved the MM but for what we dont know. Is there anyway of finding out which battles he would have fought in? I am going on Western front tour in May and would be interested in knowing

Paul Nixon said...

First of all you need to find the mention of the award in the London Gazette. That will tell you which regiment/battalion he was serving with when he won the MM. Typically, an announcement would appear in the LG between three and ten weeks after the action for which the medal was awarded. So count back ten weeks from that date and then search the battalion war diary. You might be lucky and find he gets a mention.

Kirsty said...

Found it, he was in 8th battalion R.W.Surrey when awarded the MM :)doesn't say what for though

Paul Nixon said...

That's great, now you need to access the battalion war diary which is at the National Archives. It may also be available online so you should check the National Archives website.

The LG doesn't give the reasons for the award, just notification of it.

What was his Queen's number?

Kirsty said...

His Queens no was L/7110

Karl said...

Hi
I am researching my great grandfather Private William Dodge, his number is 3892, who joined the 5th Reserve Battalion East Surrey Regiment in 1916. I have been fortunate in that his Pension Records survived and indicate that he enlisted on 8th April 1916 and was injured January 1917. After spending a year in various hospitals he was transferred to the APC in Dover with the rank if Corporal.
Where I am haviung difficulty is that I cannot read the handwriting on the Pension Records for where he was injured.
I would be most grateful if anyone could help in trying to track down where he would have been in 1917.
Regards
Karl Davies

Paul Nixon said...

Karl

He embarked with the 5th Bn on the 1st Jan 1917 and was posted to the 7th Bn on the following day, subsequently spending time in hospitals at Camiers, Etaples and Wimereux. He was not wounded but was hospitalised due to trench fever and neuralgia. His pension claim mentions rheumatism and debility.

Paul

Karl Davies said...

Hi Paul
Many thanks for responding so quickly and helping to clear this up for me.
This has now filled in a blank within the faily history.
Kind regards
Karl

Anonymous said...

Hi Paul

I wonder if you are able to help. We are looking for information on Frank Prichard, Private 28949, 9th Battalion who died in France on 23rd September 1918 (of his wounds). I've looked on Ancestry and Find My Past but we cannot find any enlistment details or what battle he was involved in when wounded. He enlisted from Ashton under Lyne and was born in Oldham about 1892.

Your blog is great and we hope that you can point us in the right direction.


Thanks, Linda

Paul Nixon said...

Linda

Frank Pritchard's medal index card indicates that he arrived overseas with the 10th Loyal North Lancashire Regiment on the 31st July 1915 and later transferred to the East Surrey regiment. His number with the LNR indicates that he probably joined the regiment in late August 1914. I'm afraid I can't suggest a transfer date to the ESR.

Anonymous said...

Hi Paul

Thank you very much for the information, there was no mention of the North Lancs in any of the records we looked at.

One further question. Can you give us advise on how to find out where he may be buried as his Great Grandson would very much like to visit the place.

Kind regards,

Linda

Paul Nixon said...

Linda

Soldiers Died in The Great war notes that he was born in Oldham and enlisted at Ashton-under-Lyne. He died of wounds on the 23rd September 1918 and is buried in Duisans British Cemetery in Etrun, France. The grave reference is VI. H. 37. The Commonwealth War Graves Commission notes the following:

"The area around Duisans was occupied by Commonwealth forces from March 1916, but it was not until February 1917 that the site of this cemetery was selected for the 8th Casualty Clearing Station. The first burials took place in March and from the beginning of April the cemetery grew very quickly, with burials being made from the 8th Casualty Clearing Station (until April 1918), the 19th (until March 1918), and the 41st (until July 1917). Most of the graves relate to the Battles of Arras in 1917, and the trench warfare that followed. From May to August 1918, the cemetery was used by divisions and smaller fighting units for burials from the front line. In the Autumn of 1918 the 23rd, 1st Canadian and 4th Canadian Clearing Stations remained at Duisans for two months, and the 7th was there from November 1918 to November 1920. There are now 3,205 Commonwealth servicemen of the First World War buried or commemorated at Duisans British Cemetery. There are also 88 German war graves. The cemetery was designed by Sir Reginald Blomfield."

Anonymous said...

Hi Paul,

Thanks very much for your help with Frank Pritchard.

Now we have turned to the maternal side of the family and are looking for records of Joseph Mason, born 1908 on Droylsden, Manchester. He was a Gunner int he Royal Artillery (No. 180939) and then believed to have moved to the Marines. He would never talk about the war and only thing was he didn't deserve the medals, but never came home with any. The family are now looking to find out what and if he got any. Where to we start as Ancestry is a bit vague on WWII.

Thanks, Linda

Paul Nixon said...

Linda, WW2 records are in short supply generally as they are still with the MoD. If he was an artilleryman though, you should contact the Royal Artillery Museum at Woolwich. It's called Firepower and they ahve an extensive archive of records including WW2 (I know that for a fact because I've been there). They'll almost certainly have basic information there and if that doesn't satisfy you - as it shouldn't - you could wite to the MoD and ask for the records. You'll need to prove you're a relative and you'll need to pay some money, about thirty pounds I think, but you should be able to get hold of the service record.

Paul

Anonymous said...

Hi Paul,

I've been researching my family but have hit a brick wall with my Great Grandfather.
I came across a marriage certificate for my Grand parents which stated that my Great Grandfather was deceased and that he was a Regimental Sergeant Major for the East Surreys. I wonder if this was true or wether my Grand Father was trying to impress the in-laws?!?
My Great Grandfathers name was Alfred George Young b.1867 in Scotland.
I have checked the usual record sources for the Great War but have found nothing and with his age I pressume that he would have been serving before the war.
If you have anyway of checking then it would me much appreciated.

Regards
Danny Young.

Paul Nixon said...

Danny, I'm afraid I've drawn the same blanks as you. I also checked the pension records on findmypast but there's nothing there that fits the bill either. Perhaps you could try contacting the Surrey History Trust to see if they have anything. Sorry not to be able to assist.

Paul

Linda Sharpe said...

Hi John

Can you please help me with Harold M Attwood, G/5715 of the Middlesex Regiment. The family story goes that he was a POW somewhere in Belgium in WW1. Is there any way we can find out any information?

Kind regards,

Linda

Paul Nixon said...

Linda

His number dates to October 1914 and he arrived oversaes on the 25th July 1917. He was entitled to the British War and Victiory Medals and the 1914-15 Star. His medal index card makes no reference to his being a PoW and as no service record appears to have survived, proving this either way could be difficult.

Paul

Steve said...

Hi Paul,

Great blog, thanks for taking the time to do it. I'm looking for a rough enlistment date od Private Arthur John Bradley of the 1st Battalion East Surrey's, No - 17879.

Only his medal cards survive. Service records for similar numbers around his have two different dates on them - The first two both mid December 1915, but they then each have another date about 6 months later. Would that be dates they enlisted and dates they completed training and were shipped abroad?

Any help would be much appreciated.

Cheers
Steve

Paul Nixon said...

Steve, all the 178** men that I have are 4th (Extra Reserve)Battalion men who joined the regiment in April and May 1916. Your man's number dates to around the 12th May 1916 or a couple of days later. The earlier date that you refer to is probably the attestation date, and if it's December 1915 the men in question almost certainly attested under the Derby Scheme, being called up later in 1916. So your man's route could have been, attests Dec 1915, called up May 1916 to 4th Bn, transfers to 1st Bn and serves overseas, qualifying for the BWM and Victory medlas.

Hope this helps

Paul

Steve said...

Ah I see, thanks Paul. Would it have been likely he transferred to 1st Battalion before leaving England or can we not really tell?

Also, is it possible to approximate a date he would have been sent abroad, I assume he would have goen through a period of training lasting a good few months?

Steve

Paul Nixon said...

Steve

Yes, The 4th Bn remained in England throughout the war and so he would have been sent as a draft for the X Bn. Not sure how long he would have been in the UK for but a look at some of the other surviving service records for this bn at this period may give some pointers.

Paul

Anonymous said...

Hi Paul
Can you help me track down George Manning Haines (sometimes spelt Haynes) who I believe served in the 1st battalion East Surreys for the whole period of WW1. Unfortunately that's the only information I have and would like to know more if possible.
Many thanks

Paul Nixon said...

There is a medal index card for L/6074 George M Haynes who served with the 1st East Surrey Regt and arrived in France on 11/9/1914 thus qualifying for the 1914 Star and clasp (which he claimed) as well as the British War and Victory Medals.

There does not appear to be a surviving service record for this man but his number indicates that he joined the East Surrey Regt in 1899. His name does not appear on the Boer war medal rolls for this regiment, however.

Anonymous said...

Sorry dont have much to start with, looking for information on my Great Grandfather Charles William Edwards on his marriage certifate dated 3rd December 1918 lists his rank/profession as 3580 Private, East Surrey Regiment...any ideas where to start looking, havn't found anything on ancestory and no family member know any details...
cheers gary

Paul Nixon said...

Hello Gary

His medal index card (accessible on Ancestry) indicates S/3580, that S/ prefix showing that he originally enlisted with the 3rd (Special Reserve) or 4th (Extra Reserve) Battalion. In fact the number pre-dates the Special Reserve (formed in 1908) and belongs to either the 3rd (Militia) Battalion or the 4th (Militia) Battalion. For the 3rd Battalion, the number dates to January 1903; for the 4th Battalion, the number dates to July 1903. So 1903 is the date he joined the militia, continued serving when the militia became the Special Reserve, and went overseas with the 2nd Battalion on the 23rd December 1914.

In the absence of a service recotd you could still check the battalion war diary. You may not find him listed by name but you'll get an idea what he was up to.

Paul

Anonymous said...

Hi Paul,I have a query about a service no. 15059 Pte. Alfred Petts died 24.11.17, all the service no's for the 8th Bn East Surreys seem to start with higher no's.
He was my Great Granfathers brother

Paul Nixon said...

Looks like a mid November 1915 enlistment to me, and his number would have been prefixed with G/.

Anonymous said...

Hi,

I have just started to look into relatives who served in WW1. I have come across a relative who was in the East Surrey Regt 8th Bttn. His army number was 30382 Pte Francis Leopold Neale KIA 3rd May 1917. I know nothing else about him but can't seem to find any service records so presume that they did not survive.
Any help is greatly appreciated.
Regards,
Ashley

Paul Nixon said...

Hello Ashley

30382 dates to between Nov 1916 and Jan 1917.

Paul

Sir Ewok said...

Hi, I am trying to find more information on my friends Grandfather. His is Private James Barrett #10712, 1st Battalion Eats Surrey Rgt who was killed in Action during the battle for Morval on 25th September 1916. I know he is commemorated on the Theipval Memorial and has no known grave. Beyond that we have little information. I would be most grateful for any extra information.

Paul Nixon said...

Sir Ewok

Despite the fact that his MIC indicates 1st Battalion, your man didn't join the regiment as a career soldier, rather just for the duration. Soldiers joining the regt as regulars had their numbers prefixed with the letter L/ and L/10712 was issued to another man, Alfred Searle. It looks as though James Barrett's number falls within a block of numbers issued in the first half of 1916 but I can't be more precise than this.

Angela Norman said...

Hi Paul
I believe my great grandfather was with the 2nd battalion as he was based at Dover in 1896 when he got married. It lists his occupation as professional soldier and he was 30 yrs old. His name was William Daniel Norman. I cannot find out any further information prior to this date about when he joined. I cannot find him on the census in 1891 but as I see that the battalion was in Ireland then that probably explains it. I would be grateful if you could point me in the right direction to explore more, or let me know if you have found any more information.
Many thanks

Paul Nixon said...

Re William Daniel Norman

Nothing at all I'm afraid. I searched service records on findmypast and Ancestry and also medal rolls on Ancestry but turned up blanks on all fronts. Possibly contact the Queen's Royal Surrey Regt to see what they suggest.

Paul McTaggart said...

Hi Paul,

I am researching a solider from the 2nd East Surrey that died in 1915. The soldier is Private Douglas Charles Wilson 1407.

I have located his medal card and also his death memorial on the Menin gate etc ... What I am interested in is his service number being so low givne that he is likely to be one of the first volunteers?

In the 1911 census Douglas is listed as living at home and being a surveyor's pupil, probably that of his father, who was a surveyor.

Can you provide any idea of his possible sign up time period and why he would have had a 1407 service number.

Regards Paul

Paul Nixon said...

Hello Paul

It's tricky because there's no prefix on his regimental number. He's possibly a recruit into the 3rd (Special Reserve) or 4th (Extra Reserve) Battalions which both started new number series at 1 in August 1914 for General Service into the two battalions. 1407 for these battalions would date to Sept/Oct 1914. If he joined a service battalion then the number is closer to August/September 1914. My guess would be that to be out in France by Feb 1915 he had probably joined the 3rd or 4th Battalion. Ruling out the TF only leaves the 3rd or 4th Bns or a service Bn. The number does definitely not belong to the series used by the regular battalions and none of the service battalions were overseas in Feb; neither do I think it very likely that they would have supplied drafts to the regular battalions. For this reason I'm plumping for the 3rd or 4th Bns, remembering that these battalions fed drafts into the regular battalions.

Paul

Marc Russell said...

Hi Paul

Don't know if you can help or if your still helping people but I'm totally stuck

I never met my great grandfather but have been trying to find information about him I know he served in the east surrey regiment his name was Henry Alfred baughan and the army number was L/7091 but that's it

I've tried looking on the Internet but can't find anything so anyone if you can help please do

Cheers
Marc

Paul Nixon said...

Hello Marc

His number tells us that he was a regular soldier who joined the East Surrey Regt around the 3rd or 4th June 1901. He almost certainly signed up for 7 years with the colours and 5 years on the reserve which would have meant he would have been "time-expired" by June 1913. He certainly served during WW1, however, arriving in France on 19th September 1914 and thus qualifying for the 1914 Star with clasp. He was an 'Old Contemptible'. That he was still serving in 1914 suggests either that he extended his service whilst with the East Surrey Regt or signed up for an additional 4 years on the reserve - Section D Reserve whilst completing his 5 years' army reserve service.

No service record or pension record appears to survive for this man and I was unable to find a Boer War medal entitlement for him either. He probably joined up just too late for the Boer war and would have been a young soldier, learning the ropes whilst the older, more experienced men were fighting in South Africa.

neil w said...

Hi Paul
Am researching my Great Grandfather Herbert Thompson from Belfast who i believe served with the Royal Irish Rifles in WW1. I have 3 photos of him and one he has no stripes and in the others he has 3 stripes. I have no other details than this but have found a medal card online which i think could be his as it has a rank of Pte then of Acting Sjt which would tie in which the photos. Would there be any way i can confirm that this medal card is his ?

Paul Nixon said...

Hello Neil

He'd appear to be a strong candidate because there are only two Herbert Thompsons that I can see for that regiment and the other man did not rise above the rank of private. So I'd say that the odds are that this is your man but you'd ideally want to find some other documentation that ties your great grandfather to the 10th Battalion and the regimental number on his medal index card. I see that the medals were issued and subsequently returned.

Paul

Anonymous said...

Hello Paul,

I'm wondering if you can help me? I'm trying to find out as much as I can about my Great Grandfather; specifically which medals he was awarded during his service. I'm told it was two, One of them being "The British War Medal, 1914-1918".

His Service details were 201621 PTE J McEvoy and he served in the East Surrey Regiment, Maybe the 1/5th.

Any Information would be massively appreciated.

Davy.

Paul Nixon said...

Hello Davy

He was entitled to the British War and Victory Medals and the number does belong to the series which was allocated to the 5th Battalion.

Paul

Davy said...

Thank you very much, Paul. I was wondering if you could advise me on how I could go about finding out when he joined the Army, left and where he served?

Thank you.

Davy.

Paul Nixon said...

Davy

My apolgies for the delay in responding.

I don't have precise details but the fact that he only got the two medals shows that he must have arrived overseas on or after 1st jan 1916, and the fact that his medal index card only lists a six-digit TF number suggests that he was not overseas until after the TF had been renumbered in early 1917. I can't be more precise on when this number would have been issued, I'm afraid.

Paul

Anonymous said...

HI

MY GREAT GRANDFATHERS BROTHER, CHARLES MARKWICK WAS KILLED AT YPRES IN 1915. HE SERVED IN THE EAST SURREY REGIMENT BUT I AM UNABLE TO FIND MUCH INFORMATION ON HIM OR WHERE HE COULD BE BURIED

Paul Nixon said...

He was L/9150 Pte Charles Markwick, 2nd Battalion East Surrey Regiment, KiA 26th April 1915. Born Brighton, living in Battersea when he enlisted at Kingston upon Thames. He was a career soldier who originally enlisted on 9th January 1907 and who had been on the Army Reserve when war was decalared in August 1914. His service record survives in series WO 363 at the national Archives (which you can also view online). He is commemorated by name on Panel 34 of the Menin Gate at Ypres.

Anonymous said...

Paul, would be very grateful for any help you might be able offer me. From the medals I have and cherish, my grandfather Pte James BASS served in East Surrey Regiment with number L/13041. I have no other information apart from a photo, which shows a 'chevron' on the arm of his uniform.

Paul Nixon said...

Re James Bass, I'm really not sure. If he was G/13041 then his number would date to July/August 1915. The L/ prefix indicates a regular enlistment and my database suggests that this would be post August 1917. The rank on his MIC indicates private but the chevron you mention, if it is on his upper forearm, indicates that he was a lance-corporal.

Paul

Eileen McIntosh said...

Hi Paul

my English grandfather joined the 1 East Surrey Regiment 18/10/1915 NO:11379 he was discharged 14/12/15 as he had lied about his age

This confuses me as he was born 30/03/1899 which made him 16 yrs

I thought that as the war had started someone of that age would have been accepted

can you help me with this?

also when he married my grandmother 15/03/1920 it is recorded that he was of no occupation ex army

which indicates to me he had rejoined or had been called up

I found a medal card for a George Woodham for E Surr R PTE Regtl. No. 20400 but it makes no sense to me

any input you can give would be most appreciated

Eileen McIntosh

Paul Nixon said...

Eileen

No, at 16 years he would have been too young. The minimum age for wartime service was 19, later reduced to 18. He may well have been conscripted in 1917 which would make 20400 George Woodham an unlikely candidate as this number dates to March 1916 (unless of course he tried to enlist again as an under age soldier in 1916 and this time was successful).

Paul

misscatto said...

Hi Paul
You have been so kind to help others in their searches. 20yrs ago I retrieved a handful of letters from a skip in Farnham, Surrey. I now live in the USA. They are letters from Man to wife from the trenches but sadly amongst the letters was a final letter of condolence/sympathy from the office of the then King (I presume A.Humphrey died). I am trying to piece together who this man was as I would like to trace his living relatives incase they would like these precious letters. If not then ill send to the Imperial War Museum. From what I can derive from the letters the man's name is: A. Humphrey, No3645,No3 Section,1st East Surrey, 14th Infantry Brigade, 5th division. He mentions he has a brother - called Arthur. His wife is Florre. He had children. The letters begin 17 March 1915 and the last one I have is dated 26 June 1916. I wonder if you can assist me in confirming his service number as I can't find him on the 3645 number. Also I would like to find his brothers service number as it would add to the chance of being able to trace any living relatives now. Any suggestions you may have are very much appreciated.
Kind regards, Charlotte

Paul Nixon said...

Hello Charlotte

3645 Alfred Humphreys was born in Marylebone and enlisted there. His medal index card (on line with Ancestry) shows he arrived in France on 17th March 1915 and was KiA on 21st July 1916. I've not had a chance to do a lot of digging on the number - or the man - but if it was a number from the regular series then it dates way back to 1891. This can't be Alfred because the CWGC notes that he was 32 when he died. So possibly he was a general service enlistment in September 1914 who found himself posted to the 1st Battalion (presumably as part of a draft to replace casualties). Have you checked census returns and births and marriages to find out more? CWGC also notes "Son of Mrs. E. Jones, of 74, Cirencester St., Harrow Rd., Paddington, London; husband of Florence Humphreys, of 77, Marsden St., Malden Rd., Kentish Town, London."

The 1911 census notes that he was a fish curer aged 27, living at 11 Bell Street, Lisson Grove, London NW. With him at that address were his wife Florence (28) and three daughters: Florence M (6), Magdalina (3) and Hilda A (6 months).

Paul

misscatto said...

Hello Paul

I was very happy to see your reply and for the very useful info contained. You have given me some excellent leads and confirmed some details. One detail of note was that his first letter home was dated the first day he arrived in France. Thank you very much, truly appreciated. I will report back in the future with any significant progress.

Kind regards,
Charlotte

Anonymous said...

Hi , I am currently researching my great grandfather George Edward Romer pte G/SR/832 2nd battalion east surrey regiment. He was sadly killed in action 23/25 march 1915 in Ypres. We have 2 dates 23rd on his service record and death cert but 25th on his gravestone in Dickebusch cemetary why would this be? . We know from my grandmothers birth cert on 2nd oct 1914 he was a private and formerly a labourer for London county council. How can we find out when he signed up? We know he was only posted in France for about 17days before he died. We don't have any photos of him is there anywhere that there would be a photo of him whilst serving in the war? Hoping I can be pointed in the right direction.

Anonymous said...

Hi Paul,

Very interesting website.

I was hoping you may be able to give me some advice.
I've only recently found out that I had a great uncle who served, and died, in WW1.
Due to the difference in age, my Nan never met him, and apparently the family did not like to talk about it.
I've been trying to find out more about him, and had a good deal of info, but the one thing I cannot find is a photo of him? But any chance did regiments take photos of soldiers? I'd love to be able to see the man, and I am sure my nan would too.

I have found a medal card, and if I am reading it right, he was awarded the Victory, British and star medals - is there a way to check if these have been claimed previously? If not, I would very much like to claim for my nan.

His details are -
John Stedeford
1 E Surrey
Rank - Sgt L/9926
Victory - E/1/103 B/6
British - E/1/103 B/6
Star - E/1/6
His medal card also mentions a clasp? NW/9/4033

Any help/advice would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks,

James

Paul Nixon said...

Re G/SR/832 George Edward Romer

This man joined the Special Reserve for wartime service only between 15th and 21st September 1914. Men joining the SR were supposed to complete 6 month's training before being posted to a line battalion and so this ties in with what you say about him not being overseas very long before he was killed. The death date on his gravestone would appear to be an error and can probably be corrected if you contact the CWGC with evidence that it is definitely incorrect. As for photos, you're probably looking for a needle in a haystack but you should check the usual sources: Imperial War Museum, regimental museum; post on Great War forum etc.

Paul Nixon said...

James

Re John Stedeford. He joined the regiment as a regular soldier in Jan/Feb 1910. It looks as though his clasp (to the 1914 Star) was returned, but there is no evidence that the medals were. They would have been issued to his next of kin. See my comment on previous post regarding photos: "... you're probably looking for a needle in a haystack but you should check the usual sources: Imperial War Museum, regimental museum; post on Great War forum etc..."

Anonymous said...

Thank you Paul for you help with George Romer

steve said...

Hi Paul I was wondering if you could supply me with any information about my grandfather Private Arthur Green 7129 who served with the East Surrey and the Royal Fusiliers GS/61821. Any information would be most grateful. Thanks

Paul Nixon said...

Re Arthur Green

I'd guess that the East Surrey Regt number is a General Service one and that it dates to around January 1915. The RF number is certainly much later and, from the little information I have, looks to date to between July and October 1917.

Paul

steve said...

Hi Paul thanks a lot for the recent information on my grandfather Private Arthur Green is there any way of finding out which battalion he served in while with the East Surrey or Royal Fusiliers. I would like to find out if possible where he was actually sent in WW1. Once again thanks a lot, you are doing a great job.

Paul Nixon said...

Steve, thank you.

You should check the medal roll for the British war and Victory Medal as this sometimes gives battalion details. If I were guessing for the East Surrey, it could be any of the service battalions, 7th to 9th inclusive, or the 10th or 11th Reserve battalions initially. I only say this because all of these battalions were in existence before Jan 1915. I really can not hazard a guess on the RF I'm afraid.

Paul

Lorraine said...

I am trying to find out anything I can about my grandad who volunteered for the East Surrey regiment in 1914 unfortunately with a surname of smith it's gonna take some time I'm sure. But here goes: Thomas William smith the number on two of his medals says 14828 pte tw smith the third medal (a bronze coloured star with a v with date 1914-1915) also marked pte tw smith but this time has number 7213? on it- evidently my grandad gave my dad the impression this was wrong ? Any help you can give would be most appreciated. Thank you

Paul Nixon said...

Lorraine

I have checked medal index cards and there is a card for the 1914/15 Star for 7213 Thomas W Smith who arrived overseas in France on 27th April 1915 and who was discharged on 21st March 1919. There is another card for Thomas W Smith of the East Surrey Regt - this time a card for the British War and Victory Medals - which lists the numbers 14828 and 242664.

Before I start making assumptions, is it possible that he could have originally joined the army in 1902? Would he have been old enough at this point in time. The number 14828 points to November 1915, but the four-digit number suggests either a regular enlistment in 1902 or a Special or Extra Reserve enlistment in 1914. I lean towards the first number but I don't know when he was born so can't be sure on this.

Paul

Anonymous said...

Hi Paul thank you for replying, my grandad was born in 1893 so wouldn't have been old enough at 1902 so we can eliminate that one. I was told he volunteered in 1914 but what is the special or extra reserve enlistment . Is it possible to find out where he would have been in france - I know he was gassed in the trenches at some point. I was also under the impression he stayed on as a regular soldier, as I remember he told my dad of some civil unrest in Scotland which I think was in 1919 . This is so interesting I can't wait to see if you can throw any light on his time in the army. Thank you

Paul Nixon said...

Hello Lorraine

I would think in that case that the first number is for the Special Reserve in 1912 or the Extra Reserve in August 1914. The second number appears to date to Nov 1915 and the final number is probably his post war number. I am sorry but I have no idea which battalions he might have served with but you should check the medal rolls at The National Archives to see if they shed any light on this.

Margaret Bund said...

I am trying to find out about a Pte A J Warren, no: 2562. We have a medal with The Great War For Civilisation 1914 - 1918 on one side. Around the side is 2562 Pte A J Warren E.Surr. R. Anything would be great or details of how we can find anything out about him. Many thanks

Paul Nixon said...

Hello Margaret

Private Warren's medal index card indicates a second number - 240730 - which in turn tells us that he served with the 6th Battalion which was a Territorial Force battalion. His four digit number tells me that he joined this battalion in late October or early November 1914. He did not arrive overseas until after 1915 and therefore was entitled to two medals, the Victory Medal which is what you have and a silver one called the British War Medal.

Paul

Margaret Bund said...

Hi Paul, Many thanks for your reply re Pte Warren

Edwina O said...

I am trying to research details for a Reginald John Dean who I believe was a member of the East Surrey Regiment (4th Battalion).

Are you aware of anyone of that name on the army register and if so would you know his army service number?

Do you know anything more about the 4th Battalion?

Thanks.

Paul Nixon said...

Edwina

I could find no man with that name combination on the National Archives' site: http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/records/medal-index-cards-ww1.htm

I searched for "Dean" and "East Surrey" which yielded 35 results (including Deane) but none of these giving the result you want.

However, there is an R J Dean listed in the Surrey Recruitment Registers which you can access on findmypast. This man was born in Battersea, a painter by trade, aged 33 years and 2 months in 1916. He is listed as joining the 4th Battalion with the regimental number 3095. He attested as Wimbledon on the 10th July 1916 and he stood five feet, four inches tall. An address is given: 24 Wortley Rd, West Croydon. He attested under the Derby Scheme but if no medal index card exists, he did not serve overseas. The 4th Battalion was an Extra Reserve Battalion which, in time would have supplied men to other battalions.

Paul

Edwina O said...

Paul

I have looked again at the Surrey Recruitment Registers and I have an identified an "R Dean" who is listed as being born in 1916 in Islington. His age range is closer in match to who I am looking for. He attested in Kingston on 27 October 1916 and his address is listed as Wimbledon. His soldier number is 19675.

Any ideas where to look next for this individual?

Thanks for your help so far.

Edwina

Paul Nixon said...

Hello Edwina. You'll need to check the usual suspects: medal cards (on Ancestry) and service and pension records (Ancestry and findmypast). You could also try the Surrey History Trust as they have some WW1 records which are currently being digitised, or maybe even awaiting publication by Ancestry.

Steve said...

Hi Paul

I have come into possession of a vintage Steamer Trunk with the initials E.R.B printed in large letters and an inscription painted on it saying:

Major JR (or could be IR) Courtney
C/o Bentalls
Kingston
Surrey

Bentalls being a large department store in Kingston. The steamer trunk is circa 1910.

I would be delighted if we could find any information regarding Major Courtney.

Steve

Paul Nixon said...

Steve, try checking the Army Lists for the East Surrey Regiment as a starter. You'll find some of these on line and others on open shelves at The National Archives.

Paul

Benallsup said...

Hi Paul,
I have recently discovered that my Grandfather fought in the East Surrey Regiment, and I am just starting out on discovering as much as I can. His name was Henry Allsup, and I have his MIC which shows his number as 39307. I know he survived the war, and later became an Military Policeman. If you can give me any pointers as to where more info could be found I would be most grateful. My father is pretty sure he fought in Ypres, but has no known dates. I guess I will end up at the National Archives at some point, but as it's not a common name, I was hoping to do most of this research online as I live in Yorkshire.

Many thanks

Ben Allsup.

Paul Nixon said...

Hello Ben

The number dates to May 1918 but is not specific to a particular battalion. He could have been overseas a couple of months later but in the absence of a surviving service record you'll be struggling to piece together a service history. I checked the service and pension records on findmypast, and also the Surrey Recruitment registers but came up with a blank.

Paul

Benallsup said...

Thanks for looking Paul, really appreciate the effort.

Kelly said...

Hi Paul,
I'm researching a soldier from the 2nd East Surrey that died on 4th June 1915. His number was 8470 and his name is 'Private E.Childs'. I've love to find out his age and first name if possible? He was buried at Elzenwalle Brasserie cemetery. I may never know how he died but would really like to know his name and age if it's possible?
Many thanks,
Kelly.

Paul Nixon said...

He was Ernest Childs. Born Epsom, attested at Kingston 20/01/1915 aged 24 years and 2 months, a carter by trade; 5ft 11 in tall, 160 lbs. Chest size 35.5 inches, expansion 2.5 inches. Rose Hill Farm Park given as an address. Record source: Surrey Recruitment Registers.

Kelly said...

WOW, that is an incredible amount of information. Thank you so much!!

Paul Nixon said...

You're very welcome, Kelly, and thank you for saying "thank you".

Paul

Kelly said...

I've just realised that the War Graves Commission do not have his age or first name recorded. Here's a link to his info:
http://www.cwgc.org/find-war-dead/casualty/455991/CHILDS,%20E
Should/can it be updated somehow?
Thanks,
Kelly.

Paul Nixon said...

Kelly, you could contact them with the additional information but I'm not sure what the process would be. I have never followed up with CWGC. There are errors and omissions on the database, as there are with any databases, but the information they record was what was provided to them at the time.

Paul

Kelly said...

I just looked, it says they take amendments, but you have to provide documented evidence.

Paul Nixon said...

Do that by citing the evidence (and source) that I gave, and also Soldiers Died in The Great War which confirms place of birth and place of enlistment as Epsom and Kingston, respectively. You'll probably also find him on census returns confirming place of birth, not to mention the GRO return.

Kelly said...

Thank you for that.
Sorry it took a while to reply, went away before Christmas and then the Christmas madness took over. I'm trying to get hold of people at the Manchester Regiment now about a possible relative of mine.
Kelly.

Geoff Belson said...

Hi paul
I was hoping you could shed some light on a soldiers enlistment. I am looking into my great grannies brother pte 5800 william thomas wiggins, he is listed as serving in the 9th bn east surreys, landed in france 17/10/1915 and KIA on 16/08/1916 at guillemont. As no service record servives we dont know when he enlisted, the information we do have is from MIC, CWGC and snippetsfrom various web sites, any help would be much appreciated thanks
Geoff belson

Paul Nixon said...

Hello Geoff

This would be a research project so please email me: paulcanixon@yahoo.co.uk and I will outline how I think I can help and what it will cost.

Best wishes

Paul

Dominic said...

Paul,

I am trying to find out some information about my Grandfather, George Smith and his service in WWI. It would appear that he served with the East Surreys (Service Number G-13616) but beyond that I don't have much (I have his Victory Medal and his British War Medal, 1914-1918) and a pay book which shows that after the War he served with the Essex Regiment in India (amongst other places) - the pay book only starts in 1924 and notes that he served during the period that the AFB 2066 was in abbeyance)

Any help would be much appreciated.

Cheers,

Dominic

Paul Nixon said...

Thanks for commenting, Dominic. Please see the RESEARCH tab.

Paul

David Clifton said...

Hi Paul

I have 4 photographs of my late grandfather FRANK JOHN CLIFTON (also used FRANK JOHN HOLMES) . I have identified his cap badge as that of the East Surrey regiment. 3 photographs look like formal studio sets, (new uniforms etc.) The last shows him standing outside a large marquee under a sign "The convalescent Depot, Army on the Rhine" On the reverse it has written in pencil the number 48356. Could this be a soldier number? It does not seem to tally with those in your listing? He was born in Burwash Sussex on 30th July 1899, so I assume he was not active until late or after WW1. I would be grateful for any information or direction to future research I could take.

Many Thanks David

Paul Nixon said...

I couldn't find anything at all for this man, David, sorry. If he served in the army after 1920 then the MoD may have papers. Try here: https://www.gov.uk/guidance/requests-for-personal-data-and-service-records

David Clifton said...

Thanks for checking, I can place him as a student in 1911 and again in 1922 working in Kent. Between the two dates I just have these 4 photographs. I will follow up the MoD and perhaps try and get the last photo interpreted showing him on the Rhine, in which he supports some ribbons on his uniform (in black and white?).
Thanks again David

Paul Nixon said...

By all means email me the photo or photos, David and I'll have a look at it/them: paulcanixon@yahoo.co.uk

JamesChick84 said...

Hi There,

I'm after a bit of help with a photo I have.

The photo is a portrait of a soldier, appears to be WW1, and is apparently a relative.

However, I only know of 2 relatives involved in the war, 2 of my great uncles. One was in the Easy Surrey Regiment, and was killed at the Somme. The other survived, and was in a London regiment.

However, the guy in the photo is dressed in a kilt. The family has absolutely no connection to Scotland, so am a little bit confused.

What makes it even more interesting, is the soldier is a spitting image of my grandfather (was only a boy at the time), and other males in the family.

Does anyone have any ideas?

Thanks,

James

Paul Nixon said...

London Scottish? (14th London Regt).

Hannah Wells said...

Hi,

I was wondering if you could tell me any more information about Frank Godbold, born 15 Oct 1894, soldier number 20821, 1st Battalion East Surrey Regiment, died of wounds 24 April 1918

Thank you,
Hannah

Paul Nixon said...

There are no surviving service records for this man, Hannah but there will be other records such as medal index card, medal roll/s, soldiers' effects register entry, soldiers died in the Great War etc. Plus it would be possible to tell when he enlisted and possibly - unless it is already stated on his medal index card - when he might have arrived overseas.

Paul

Hannah Wells said...

That's great thanks Paul. Which websites/sources would my best bet be of finding these documents please?
Hannah

Jay Ratty said...

Hi Paul,
Excellent blog, thanks for the resource.

I'm trying to find out my great grandfathers (Pte James Dunlop) East Surrey regt history, specifically any Boer war involvement.
I have a QSA Medal engraved '2347 Pte J.Dunlop, East Surrey regt' (QSA With 2 x bars S/Africa 1902 and Cape Colony) but cannot confirm if this was actually issued to him.
It has, at some time, been ground and re-stamped with his details.
(Family story is that he enlisted under age, being born in 1880)

He has, on his WW1 Attestation form, stated 'Previous service with 4th East Surrey Militia'.
His WW1 medals are stamped as follows:
1914-1915 Star, engraved '7-220 E.Surr.R'
British war medal '220 East Surry regt'
Victory medal '220 East Surry regt'
I believe he served with the 4th Machine gun corps, and then the 6th Tank corps, which is about all I've been able to glean from the fire damaged records.
I'd really like his WW1 units confirmed as well, if possible, as again, the fire damage was quite severe.
Any help would be greatly appreciated,
Many thanks.
Jason

Paul Nixon said...

Thanks Jason, I have emailed you regarding this man.

Paul

Leslie Jellicoe said...

Hi paul
I am trying to find out what my granddads service records/ medals or any other information about him his was norman jellicoe from new ferry wirral he was killed in tunisia in 1943. He was in the eastsurry 1st battalion he was 21 when killed. My late father was only 6 months old when he was killed and my nan never talked about him so i dont know anything about his service. He is buried in Medjez-el-bab War Cemetery 1. D. 11., Tunisia i dont know if you can help but i look forward to hearing from you either way thanks les jellicoe

Paul Nixon said...

Hello Les. WW2 records are still with the MoD and so you'll need to contact them directly: https://www.gov.uk/government/collections/requests-for-personal-data-and-service-records.

Leslie Jellicoe said...

Thanks paul i will give that a go thanks for your time